Ari Afsar & Jen Bender
From left to right: Jen Bender & Ari Afsar. Images courtesy of Ari Afsar and Jen Bender.
I got the lucky chance to chat with Ari Afsar and Jen Bender, who are both extraordinary women in the industry. Their current project: a new musical about Jeannette Rankin, the first woman ever elected to Congress in 1916 (before women even had the right to vote. . .) called Jeannette. Ari Afsar is the creator, composer and lyricist for the new musical and Jen Bender is producing it. Jeannette Rankin is someone whose story needs to be told. Learn more about how Ari and Jen worked on this remarkable new project together and learn about their stories individually.
You’ll also notice that for the first time, there’s a video section of this article on Shesources! I asked Jen and Ari about their decision to use Jeannette’s online platform to endorse different political candidates running for office around the country. We talked about the need to get political now more than ever in the theatre community, and I felt that conversation was one that the reader needed to see and watch to engage in. Read, listen, and watch below! All the links to support Jeannette are throughout the piece and grouped together at the end.
How do you identify as an artist and a creative?
Ari: As a composer and a musician, and actor/performer/storyteller.
Jen: I go by the title “producer” but for me that means a facilitator of bringing artists together and matchmaking people who I think are really great creative minds and putting them together to make new work.
Why do you like what you do?
Jen: Well for me, I am someone who has always been part of the arts. I love the arts. I was good at a lot of aspects of the arts but not great at any one thing and what I like about what I do now is I get to work with people who are the best at what they do. One thing that I love is making new work. I love existing work, but the thing that really drives me is creating something that hasn’t been created before. Something that matters to the culture and the zeitgeist, and things that are entertaining but are about more than just the entertainment. I love that I get to work on projects that I really believe in. I have my own company so I don’t have to work on something that someone else thinks is interesting or is going to make money. I get to say: this is a thing that I really love and that’s where I’m going to put all my time and energy.
Ari: I love what I do because I believe that art is very powerful and it has the power to really change culture and we need to change culture before we change policy. I think I will stop loving what I do when that’s not the underbelly of the work that I am a part of.
Could you both talk about your individual journeys? The career choices that you made, the twists it took, etc. Did you think you’d be here right now in this spot in your life?
How did the creative team of Jeannette meld together? How did you all find each other and how did you go about the beginning stages of creating a new work like this?
Ari: So I created a concept album— which, plug, the concept album will be released by Sony which is really really exciting.
That is exciting congrats!
Ari: Thank you! I worked on this concept album and started performing it as much as possible. I essentially wrote five, six songs loosely about this woman Jeannette Rankin. I got connected through a mutual friend to Lauren Gunderson who is now the book writer and is America’s most produced playwright. I sent her the music ahead of time and we hopped on what was supposed to be a 15 minute call and it ended up turning into a 2 hour call. By the end of it, she was like we’re writing this musical. I immediately started talking about the idea— I’m not a person that keeps things precious— I feel like me talking about it is also me brainstorming and figuring out what is interesting to people or not interesting. So I was talking about it a lot, this idea, and then I talked about it to Alex Gemignani who played the King in Hamilton, his wife, Erin Ortman, is from Montana and is a badass director. She was the only person I’d met in my couple of months talking about Jeannette Rankin who had heard of her. We just started talking and I beat around the bush and I was like “Erin would you like to join this project? I don’t know what any of that means but…” then Erin brought on our musical supervisors. Then we were at the O’Neill last summer—
Jen: That was just a year ago, isn’t that crazy?
Ari: Jen I feel like I’ve known you for years
Jen: I know!
So you only met a year ago last summer?
Jen: Like maybe a year and a half ago. We met through Erin, and Erin invited me to a table read that was really not even a table read— it was Ari recording her and three actors reading all the parts. I said “Oh this is really cool, keep me posted on what’s going on!” and then they got into the O’Neill so I said “I could maybe help bring people into the O’Neill to see the piece” and I was just in love with it. So after the O’Neill I said I want to produce this piece. Then I came on board!
Ari: Yeah. And we had been courting Jen. There were a lot of conversations of like: well Jen needs to come to this and make sure Jen’s invited to that.
Jen: And even before the O’Neill we started planning the SubCulture concert because I said this music’s so great, we should do a concert and get this music out into the world.
Ari: Yeah I know you didn’t come on officially before the O’Neill but . . .
Jen: Around March or April is when I said “If you guys need any help…” and “We should do a concert and I’ll produce that for you”. So that was really all I signed on for which was: we should do a concert, that will be fun. Then you got into the O’Neill and that’s when things were really rolling.
How did you get into the O’Neill?
Jen & Ari: You apply.
Oh, great. Here I was thinking it was some secret magic potion.
Ari: Yeah you just apply. The O’Neill is really great in taking chances. We 100% were a chance type of opportunity because Lauren is really established but I have not been established. And we were only a year and a half into development when a lot of times, pieces take much longer before they get to the O’Neill. But I think that they saw the importance and impertinence of it and they took a chance which really expedited our growth. We had to really step our game up to make sure we were prepared. We ended up being really successful at the O’Neill so I believe we rose to the occasion to be able to meet the expectations.
Was it your intention to have an all-women creative team? Well actually that’s my mistake it’s not all women right?
Ari: We have a token man
Haha!
Jen: I don’t think it was ever the intention though. I think it was just that this piece attracted a certain type of personality who was a woman and we all feel like women just get shit done. Yeah it felt like it kept attracting the right kind of people and those people were women. And in Todd’s case he was the right person to be the orchestrator and he happens to be a man. But it was never meant to be a no-boys-club. It just naturally panned out like that.
Our discussion about getting explicitly political in theatre and the Jeannette team’s decision to take up political space:
I just want to say I think it’s really cool to watch your team do that online. It feels gutsy and it’s cool to watch you stand up for what you believe and for what the show stands for. Do you feel like it’s something that the pandemic has allowed in a way, because we’re in a standstill position with theatre that it’s like, what else are you going to do?
Jen: 100%. I think without the pandemic, Ari, you and Lauren just wouldn’t have the time to do these virtual events every week.
Ari: No or the resources because they wouldn’t have been virtual and we wouldn’t have been able to travel all over the country. We were supposed to perform at the Library of Congress for the female Chief of Staff and Congress members which was supposed to be nonpartisan but with the specificity of our show would not have ended up being. So I do still believe that we would be “gutsy” besides the pandemic but I think it’s allowed a lot more opportunities to dive in deeper with the work like Jen was saying.
Jen: Yeah I think pre-pandemic, any kind of political thing that we did felt like a bonus. We were making a musical and if we could then reach a broader audience that was great. Now it feels like activism is our front and center focus through the election. The show continues to be developed but we’ve pivoted in terms of how we’re choosing to spend our time and energy.
That’s really awesome. Pivoting to a different kind of question: as audience members, what kinds of stories do you wish you saw more of on stage?
Ari: Just really complex female identifying or nonbinary stories.
Jen: For me it’s things that are innovating the art form. I think that musical theatre is the greatest American art form because it combines plays, music, dance, sometimes puppetry, projection. There’s no limit to what can be in musical theatre and I think we’re the only art form that allows every other discipline to fall under the umbrella of musical theatre. So for me a lot of it is seeing the art form being innovative. And Seeing more complex, sophisticated characters. There’s a sense a lot of times that sounds like: Oh it’s a musical! It’s cute and that’s all sweet for a musical. But then people go home and they watch really innovative shows on HBO. That’s our same audience. So it’s not that our audience can’t handle richer, more compelling content I think there’s this sense often that musicals are sort of just a cute, fun entertainment. I wish there were more musicals geared towards the same audience who’s watched Breaking Bad. We see it in plays but why aren’t we going further in musicals? And I love a classic musical so I hate when directors are like: I hate musicals but I’m directing musicals. I’m like if you hate musicals, then get out! Get someone who thinks this is the greatest American art form! So I’m not poo-poo-ing on classic musicals, because I grew up on those.
What do you hope audience members, in a post-covid world when we can all sit in a theater again, will take away from Jeannette?
Ari: That they have the power within themselves to make the change that they want to see. I believe it takes every single person, and we cannot be apathetic, in order to fight for an equitable world. There are some times when folks are not going to have the energy and that's when other folks need to step up. So I hope that this piece gives inspiration and light and encouragement to individuals who don't necessarily see themselves as a leader or as a fighter or as a change-maker, to finally see that in themselves.
Jen: And I’d expand on that. Yes to all of those things. I also hope that some people come to see the show and say “I’ve never heard of Jeannette Rankin, I can’t believe I didn’t know who the first Congresswoman is.” And maybe that person is a science major and says:" “Wait, who was the first female Nobel Prize winner for science?” I hope that people also take this idea of: there was this incredible person that I’ve never even heard of. What are the other stories of women and BIPOC trail blazers that have been pushed out of the history books?
My last question is: what’s bringing you joy right now?
Jen: I’ve been in the yard, I’ve been gardening. We all have these projects on our to-do lists that get pushed to the back and for me it has just been very freeing to feel like I’m not running on a treadmill that is led by other people’s schedules. . . It always felt like I didn’t have time for the things that bring me personal joy. Right now, just being in the yard— I made a garden and I’ve been landscaping and going back to nature. I’ve always been a super outdoorsy person and having the time to literally get my hands dirty is bringing me a lot of joy.
Ari: Similarly, I’m trying to make small travels as much as possible. So two weekends ago I went to Zion and last weekend I went to the Bay Area. I was supposed to go backpacking this weekend but the fires cancelled our permits which is good. Not good that the fires are happening but good that they’re being proactive for everyone’s safety. Then I might go to Joshua Tree next weekend. California is such a beautiful state I’m so grateful to be living here, it’s home for me, but especially right now there are so many outdoor activities that are so accessible. So that’s what’s bringing me joy right now.
I have some speed round questions to wrap it up!
That’s a wrap! Thank you so much Ari and Jen for sharing your stories with us.
If you want to learn more about Jeannette Rankin and Jeannette: A New Musical, visit their website here.
The Jeannette instagram is here, their Facebook page is here, their YouTube channel is here, and their twitter is here.
Listen to the Jeannette concept album, available on all streaming platforms here.
